Difficulties in obtaining jobs in Australia

devanya

devanya

New Member
Dear all,

I want to share our story with you because I feel that it is a common story that people are not being told in the Netherlands before they make the big move to Australia. I am an Australian who also has the Dutch nationality who is married to a Dutch man and had lived in the Netherlands for seven years. For the last two years we were busy in the Netherlands planning our big move to Australia. This was my husbands dream to live here and I naturally wanted to return home to Australia after living away for such a long time. We were full of dreams and ideas about how wonderful it would be to live here and I couldn't wait to come home. We arrived in Australia in Feb. of this year.

My husband studied hard for many years and has a Bachelor of Education (mathematics) a Bachelor of ICT and an MBA, he worked for the last eight years for one of the Netherlands largest banks as a Project Manager. I am not mentioning these qualifications and experience to 'brag' but more to set the scene of how we thought with all of his educational qualifications and IT Management experience with a stable work history that we would be 'set' in Australia considering that the Australian Government are telling Europeans that there is a skill shortage here.

I can only tell you that since we arrived back in my homeland in February this year our dreams have come crashing down around us. He met with at least 60 recruitment agencies around Melbourne and was continually told that he was lacking Australian experience. After mixing with other expats who are even higher qualified than him, even doctors who have Phd's, they also have the same stories to tell that they are not valued because they do not have Australian experience and cannot get their 'foot in the door'. As an Australian it saddens me to say that this country is full of arrogant people who unfortunately think that Australians know it all and they look down at foreign experience. It is extremely difficult to get your foot in the door and when my husband finally did, it was for a salary at half his normal salary in the Netherlands and unfortunately for a company that had many management issues. Bart has now applied to revert back to teaching which he has not done for quite a number of years and I can only brace myself for the next lot of interviews where he is told that he lacks Australian experience.

The reason I am telling you this story is that I would like to let those who have children know that it is not as easy as you think it is to immigrate and work here. Think very seriously before you give up your jobs,  homes and say goodbye to your families and friends and your security. He and I both had very good jobs in the Netherlands, a lovely home and wonderful family and friends. We left all of this behind for what we thought was a greater lifestyle for our children; however what we found was a great amount of stress and frustration. As an Australian it was easy for me to get work when I returned but a different story for him. There is definetely discrimination here and please ensure you have work here before you make the costly move in immigrating here.

Of course you hear the success stories, but people are unfortunately not so brave in coming out with the stories where they didn't succeed here. It is a hard country to live in when you don't have work.

Kindest regards,

D.
 
On the other hand.. I went to Australia as a backpacker and it was fairly easy for me to find jobs. The initial difficulties I had were mainly focused on me staying only for a short period of time before moving on, whereas most employers wanted me long term. However, on all occasions I was able to find work within a matter of hours (for about a month or two at a time), and my wages weren't too bad either. However I didn't manage to find work with an Australian employer. During my year I only worked for Asian employers and on each occasion they were happy to have me. I was told several times that they rather employed foreigners because they considered Australians 'lazy' and too 'laid back'. It may depend on the state and/or city you're in. I had huge difficulties finding work in and around Melbourne, so I moved on as quickly as I could to Perth where they were really desperate for workers!
 
Hi Alie,

Thanks for your reaction! It's true about Melbourne being difficult to find work in (of course this also depends on the type of work you are searching for). We had originally planned to move to Adelaide but when we saw the amount of jobs in Bart's area of expertise advertised in Melbourne we assumed that with his experience and education that this would be highly valued. I cannot speak for the other states in Australia, only the attitude in Melbourne. As stated in my posting, when you have children involved in an immigration you have the extra pressures of ensuring that you create a financial stability for their future and this is what we left behind in the Netherlands. We went to the immigration beaurs and believed what we were told about skilled migrants needed Down Under. What the Government doesn't tell people, is that within the corporate sector they generally only want people with Australian experience and don't open their doors easily to foreigners. You see a lot of 20 something young 'want to be' type people in Management positions in Melbourne without the education to back up their positions. It seems that education is not as important here and the value is more highly placed on your job title. We thought we had done all of the research before we left the Netherlands and when we saw the huge amount of jobs advertised that Bart could do we assumed that there would be no problems in him obtaining work.
 
Hi Devanya,

I'm sorry to hear about the trouble Bart has in finding a suitable job. I actually experienced it totally differently. I arrived in Melbourne around 4.5 years ago and found a job almost instantly. One thing I would say about the australian corporate world is that they _do_ accept foreigners and wouldn't blink twice when, for example, a meeting is led by someone who's first language obviously isn't english. Perhaps it's more common in my industry (broadcasting / IT) but it's quite telling that in my team literally 50% is not australian.

Don't get me wrong; I think it's great that you warn people that it's not the promised land here, I believe it's a message much needed on this forum. I just thought i'd let you know that it can also work out quite nicely.I really Hope Bart will get the right position in no time.

Cheers
 
Hi Suske,

Many thanks for your response. It can also be the type of work that Bart is in (IT Management within the banking industry), however I have also heard many stories about doctors that also go through 'hell' to work here. As I had said, there are of course success stories, but there are so many people on this forum like Bart and I that are full of dreams and hopes and imagine that they can step immediately into the same type of job with the same salary that they had. I am truly happy to hear the success stories because I am Australian and it gives me hope that not all Australian's in the corporate sector are small minded and welcome foreigners! I think also because when I came to the Netherlands I was welcomed by the Dutch and had the job of my dreams within two weeks and enjoyed not only a good job, good income but also stability and more money that what I earned in Australia. I just assumed that the Australian's would be open to foreigners in the same way....
 
My experiences are quite more positive. I've started looking for a job by mid July, and started working on the 9th of September. I found my job not through a recruiter, but by applying directly. I have to add that the company I work for is very open to foreigners. A large part of the workforce consists of non-Australians. In general (as I've been told) they are even more positive about the quality of the people from overseas compared to the Australian candidates.

And all this in Adelaide, where there is a lot less work for me (C++/Java software engineer) compare to cities like Sydney, Melbourne, or Brisbane.
 
Same for me, I met my recruiter during our Holiday in 2007.
In June he arranged an interview for me with a small (12 people) Australian company.

After two interviews by phone they offered me a job.

Regards,
Johan
 
Hi Devanya,

Mabye Bart should look for a job at foreign banks. I.e. Rabobank and ING both have internetsaving accounts in Australia and Rabo also has offices in Ozzy.

I also found a job (In Sydney, with help from a recruiter) and it wasn't that hard. But I made a salary-offer (around 20% less than in The Netherlands) because the first months I sould get familiair with the language, workculture/style and legislation. Once this is behind my back (?) I will be able to function the same as in The Netherlands and also my salary should rise to the old level.

My new boss is also an immigrant (UK). This also helps a lot!

Good luck with finding a job.

Cheers,
Loek
 
Hi

Yes it is not always easy.  However I think you can not go to another country expecting to quickly have a similar job with the same salary (if you do you're a lucky one).  When we came we went down to 40% of our dutch salary (happy to get started) What I also have found over the years that it doesn't matter how many qualification you have in other fields (good for your own knowledge. I don't even put them in my resume anymore if they are not applicable to the job.)  Being over qualified is not always a good thing.
I know I have high expectations and had to adjust.

Good Luck with finding a job.

Sidonia  
 
I also have the feeling that attitude is as even  important in Australia as experience,maybe more !! From what I have heard already is that Australian way of communicating is quite different then the Dutch , so very important if you are looking for a job as a project manager.

It is good that you warn other people offcourse , but also a very personal experience I am afraid.

But on the other hand, we will only move to Australia with having a job, because we are also settled here with children, off course it is better to be sure of a job.


I wish you all the best and hopefully your husband will find a suitable job soon.
 
Thanks for your story, Devanya. It is important for people to know what can happen.

I was lucky enough to have a sponsored visa, so the job was secure for me. For my wife it was a different story... She is a qualified artist/graphic designer, and has the same visa as I do. We tried for several months to find a suitable job for her on the Central Coast and in Sydney, applying directly and through agencies, but to no avail. She even applied for jobs way below her qualifications, without success. She is now picking up more of her art work independently, and that seems to work much better.

I don't know if it is the 'uncertainty factor' or something else that's causing it. I know at the company I work for (multinational food manufacturer), it is encouraged to employ foreigners. But apparently that is not the case everywhere. There will definitely be differences between branches and job types too.

It is a fact, however, that unemployment is up in Australia. It's in the news constantly. And looking at the job add pages in the local news paper: a year ago it was 4-6 pages every week, now it is more like 2-3. So it is important for people to realize that getting a job here is NOT always easy.

Fortunately, there are plenty success stories out there too.

Good luck with finding a suitable job for Bart!

Sander
 
Hi all,

I can certainly agree with the person who started this topic.

It took me a while to get a job (about 5-6 months) but that had more to do with me being picky (the only qualification I had was a Teaching Degree, and there was only one thing that I didn't want to do and that was teaching!). We also live in regional Victoria, so the job market is definitely smaller that in capital cities. My present job is without a doubt more rewarding, enjoyable and less stressful than my teaching job in Holland, but I earn 20% less. It is close to my dream job, so no complaints from my side.

My partner is a slightly different story: Teaching Degree, Master Degree Cultural Geography, wrote her dissertation in Australia, got a job offer to teach at Groningen University ..... but over here, she works already for more than a year in a Newsagency, doing very basic administrative work. Besides it's a 0,5 FTE job she earns 35% less compared to her wages in Holland. She does a lot of voluntary work at the moment (at least 20 hours a week), but again... in the region where we live in, dream jobs aren't falling out of the sky! With the help of voluntary work, she is gaining Australian work experience.

It depends a lot in which region, sector you want to work in, and in which field you have experience.

Cheers Sander
 
Funny how things can work out.
I moved to Broome being warned about the work situation: not much work, underpaid, Broome is too expensive to live. When arriving here the jobs were everywhere, in my field of work: social work. But I was not up to anymore social work for a while and did not really know what to do. Two days after arrival via via I was asked to apply for a position (project coordinator of Minyirr Park). I quit because I found it too stressful (intern dynamics) but was offered to stay on in a slightly different position for at least 6 months. And I enjoy it. It is mainly administrative but interesting with nice collegues. Dutchionality doesn't matter and is accepted widly, seems to be just a normal thing around here.
I hope your chances will turn in 2009! And I think it is good advice to focus on a Dutch bank for a while, maybe even just to get contacts through them.

Fae
 
Dear Divinia,

When i was looking for work in London, the recruiters often prefered to give the job to backpackers from Australia or Canada because they are part of the common wealth. They always got the better jobs! There is a post under Skilled Migration stating that visa procedures for applicant of Great Bbrittain are obtained faster then the other foreigners. Now that the economy is crashing, i am sure it will be getting even more difficult to find a job as a non common wealth foreigner. I am not saying it will be impossible but you will earn less ,that is for sure.
 
Hi Devanya,

How are things now?

When I moved over here, I did not expect to find a job in my area of expertise (general insurances), especially since I did not have correct the diploma's, which are only valid in The Netherlands.
In 6 weeks I found a job in insurance business (life and income protection) with a large international firm. I also had to make some sacrificies, such as 3 weeks less paid annual leave and I earn over 20% less.
You have to start some were, especially to gain experience. I'm very happy with this job and I think things can only get better from here on. You have to start somewhere. I feel lucky that this opportunity was offered to me, especially being new to the country and it being my first job in Australia as well  :grin:

Goodluck! Hope things turn out well soon!

Regards, Vanja
 
Hi Vanja,

I am glad things worked out for you! I think the readers of this forum misunderstood a point and thought that Bart wanted to earn the same income here in Australia that he did in the Netherlands. This is not the case. He was and is, happy to get any salary just to get his  so called 'Australian experience'. Money is not an issue for us, it is the fact that it is difficult for a lot of foreigners to get their initial foot in the door here in Australia. When you work in the banking industry as Bart does, you are basically tied to the big four banks here. One of the readers of this forum suggest he contacts the Rabobank and ING bank here. Trust me, we had covered those bases already; both in the Netherlands before we left and here in Australia. They are very small here and their head offices are in Sydney whereas we are based in Victoria. Also in typical Australian fashion (don't forget I am Australian and can openly criticise my own kind! LOL) they do not call you back no matter how hard you chase them!

My point for posting the topic was not to get sympathy etc. because I truly believe things will work out for us in the end, but more to alert people who have children, good job security, family, friends and a nice home to think twice before they give this all up and make the move to the relative unknown. Yes, we are told that there is a skills shortage here by the Government, but the private sector makes it very difficult for those with skills to get a foot in the door. Of course the readers of this forum come from all types of different industry and probably have a lot of success with jobs when they get here. I can only speak of our experience and the experience of other expats we have met along the way who have also experienced the same as Bart.

My final words on this subject are do your research and have some tangible job offers before you take the plunge. If you do have a job, the lifestyle is beautiful (I can attest to this because we live in a beautiful estate with a golf course and country club in Hidden Valley in Victoria: http://www.hiddenvalleyaustralia.com.au/golf_home.html )and truly a lovely place to raise your children.

The best of luck to you all and I hope to post a positive outcome in the near future!

Kindest regards,

Devanya
 
Hi Devanya,

I think it's a good thing that you posted this one here, because we have the same problems and it is good to give people a warning of what might happen!

We moved to Australia 2 years ago, on a skilled independent. Marcel is a carpenter, according to the visa there would be heaps of jobs for him, that's why we got the visa. I was just going to tag along and hopefully find some work in the disability sector. Before we went we checked all the jobs-sites and at the time there were loads of jobs in Sydney.

I must say, we didn't own a house and didn't have any kids, but it's still a big move...

When we got here, it was pretty hard to find a job (and we did give ourselves a holiday for a bit)....but after 4 months I got a job as a RSW with the goverment, so I was sorted. I have been working there ever since and it's a very secure job to have, as they can't just fire you.....

Marcel however found it really hard to find a job and he only found a job as a carpenter on a casual basis. The job was shit and sometimes he only worked 3 days a week. After a year or so, he finally found another job, as a full time carpenter.

Last week they fired him, so now I'm the only one with a job. They didn't have any work and didn't put his weight in....but he was the only one who did 9 hours overtime without getting paid for it.....how is that not putting your weight in?? Marcel contacted fair trading as we thought you had to get 3 written warnings, but no, in this case they could fire him without reason...

What we didn't realise back in the Netherlands is that Marcel is not seen as a licensed carpenter here. Therefore he can only apply for jobs where he doesn't need to have a license. Most of the jobs ask for a license, your own tools which he had to buy for 1000's of dollars all together and most of the jobs require you to have a ute as well. My papers are also not recognised, but that wasn't a problem.

If you get the visa, you expect that they will see you as a full skilled carpenter, but unfortunatly that's not the case....

Also, there are hardly any carpenter jobs over here. He applied for 2 but they were already taken the same day....could be due to the small recession, but it's not looking good out there.

That's why I would like to give future immigrants the same advise as you already did.....do not come out here expecting to find a job. And me personally, after these two years, which haven't been easy, I would advise not to immigrate if you do not have a job set out for you here.

Also, renting wise, you don't have any security here! That's what we didn't realise either, we thought if you rented somewhere it was safe. But, at any time they can take the rental place of you ago, with written notice. You can't put any nails in the walls without written consent and 99 out of 100 times you can't have pets. Places that do allow pets are shitholes....We just got a letter with a 60 days notice, that's all they have to give you if they don't give you a reason. If they sell the joint, you're lucky if an investor buys it and you can stay, but don't expect to be safe in a rental place. The only time they can't kick you out at any time is when you actually own the property and that's not our case.....

Don't get me wrong, you might end up in a rental where you can live for 10 years, but it does happen a lot that the owner sells up and you're kicked out....moving 9 times in 10 years is quite normal....

I just wanted to share another bad experience as a warning for any future ozzies, and for those where australia did give you everything you wanted; good on ya, but for us it turned out to be a big dissapointment....

Don't get me wrong it is a beautiful country and I absolutely love the country itself, but as long as you don't own your own place and don't have a permanent job, the grass isn't that green over here....

It might be the same in the Netherlands by now, jobwise speaking, but I do know, if you rent a house in the netherlands, you rent it for life, if you want.....

Good luck to you Devanya!!!!

Angelique
 
ANG: I totally agree, almost the same with us. Altough we think we can stay for longer time in this house, the landlord is very happy with us but you never know :lol:.
My partner who got the skilled visa, is also not a licenced electricien and therefor not allowd to work as a A qualified electricien, other jobs require investments and a car etc...At the moment he got a job in a hotel at the beach here in Perth so we will be fine for a while. Hopefully the economie will get better ( mines etc.. ).

SO new OZzIES be aware!

:smile:
Monja
 
I was in very much the same situation as devanya and have almost the same qualifications as her husband.

My theory is that I was overqualified and too old and employers fear that if you are any good, you will not stay long for the sort of money they are willing to pay.

No Australian experience is simply not true because the whole IT industry in Australia survives on foreigners, very few Australians. In the end I was lucky that my previous employer (US company) wanted me back although it did require a move from the Gold Coast to Sydney. I am now actually in a better job and earning more than I would have been in The Netherlands but I guess I was lucky.

People I now deal with daily at my company as well as customers include Aussies, Chinese, Indian, Korean, Taiwanese, Chilean, Argentinian, Norwegian, Swiss, Dutch, Belgian, British and German.
 
Hi all. I relate to the renting story! The house that we are renting is now up for sale and yesterday we signed the contract to build our home. I hope the home is built before our rental house is sold.

We have decided (obviously) to stay here. For our children it is ideal to live where we do and the community here is lovely. We wanted our own home again and are desperate to unpack our moving boxes finally into a final destination! It was a strange feeling to sign the building contract because in one way it was a decision that we will not be returning to the Nethelands. I never thought I would say this, but I do miss the Netherlands! I'm over seeing in every shopping centre: Target, Kmart, Big W etc. If only I could have a day in Rotterdam or Utrecht to shop and have a lovely lunch with a dam good coffee and cake in la Place. Oh how I miss la Place! Even dare I say it, I miss the slagroom taart van de Hema....heerlijk. Ja, een beetje burgelijk ook! Don't get me started on how I miss Dudok appel taart!

On the job front, Bart had an interview today and has an interview tomorrow, so we will wait and see what eventuates.

Keep your experiences coming, for those who do find it difficult to find work, it unalienates their experiences to share them and talk about the frustrations etc.

Best regards,

Devanya :roll:
 
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